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 on: 08 December 2018 09:17:01 AM 
Started by PennyRambler - Last Post by PhiloNauticus
As indicated above, he would have stayed 'on the books' of Terror until he joined the next establishment.  If it was in the 1930's he may well have travelled back to UK on a troopship.

Could you post up details of his service? or give dates etc?

 on: 08 December 2018 12:20:20 AM 
Started by PennyRambler - Last Post by PennyRambler
Thanks for the reply and sorry for the late acknowledgement.

The service record I have is from the MOD ( Unfortunately it doesn't show passage. One day he is in Singapore and the next he is in Plymouth.

Searches on the National Archives website don't find any matches. Are there any other possible sources I can try for the more complete record?


 on: 16 November 2018 09:05:37 AM 
Started by Ian Old - Last Post by PhiloNauticus

It will have been 'Gazetted' i.e. published in the London Gazette, which will give some background -  What was his name?

 on: 15 November 2018 11:18:23 PM 
Started by Ian Old - Last Post by Ian Old
I have been asked by a colleague to assist his family is researching a relative who served in WWI and WWII.  The major problem is not being able to locate the citation for the Distinguished Service Cross awarded in 1944 to a RNR Temp. Skipper, serving on a minesweeper.  Does anyone know how to locate the details as to why the DSC was awarded?

 on: 12 November 2018 10:57:56 AM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by Noel Clark
Does anyone have access to this narrative, authored (at least part III) by Surgeon Lieutenant-Commander E.L. Markham, O.B.E., M.B., R.N., which I believe was published in the Naval Review in three parts in 1921 (volume 4) and 1922 (volumes 1 and 2).

I can't seem to find any on-line access to this publication, and would greatly like to obtain a copy of the "Narrative."

Thank you,

 on: 12 November 2018 10:38:43 AM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by Noel Clark
Thank you for the explanation. I understand now.

 on: 11 November 2018 02:46:03 PM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by James_harvey
Qualifying period for BWM started on 1st day of way so they qualified 28 days after the start of war

A training base still qualified as he was in uniform for 28 days

One of the last ww1 veterans only had the bwm as he joined the navy in last few months of ww1 and never had overseas service



 on: 11 November 2018 10:26:54 AM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by Noel Clark
James, I'm afraid that I'm not quite sure what you're saying there.

Are you saying that the BWM I have and impressed "Boy 2" is that way because that's the rating he had when he completed his first 28 days mobilised service whilst at Ganges II? If so, I hadn't realised that a training base would be deemed "mobilised service."

And that the VM shown on the Medal Roll, and missing, would have related to his operational service on HMS Caradoc in South Russia in 1919 and up to 1st July 1920 and would have been impressed with his rating at that time - i.e. "Boy 1" or "Ord" - the latter shown on the Medal Roll?


 on: 11 November 2018 08:44:15 AM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by James_harvey
For RN service only all sailors were issued the BWM for 28 days service ashore or afloat in the U.K. or overseas

He must have served operationally to get the victory medal.

This caused anger when the raf were formed as the army did not award the BWM for home service



 on: 11 November 2018 08:00:05 AM 
Started by Noel Clark - Last Post by Noel Clark
I hope someone can help me with this query.

Edward Leonard Charles Watsham J86934 enlisted in the Royal Navy as a "Boy 2" at the age of 16 on 27th March 1918, from the Training Ship "Exmouth."  His first ship was the training ship HMS Impregnable. On 27th July 1918 he joined the training ship HMS Ganges II; he remained there until 26th February 1919, being made "Boy 1" on 27th December 1918. He was therefore a "Boy 2" when the war started.

On 27th February 1919 he joined HMS Caradoc, where he remained until 29th January 1921, being made Ordinary Seaman on 4th February 1920, and Able Seaman on 13th January 1921. While he was on HMS Caradoc, she was part of the 3rd Light Cruiser Squadron, and was in the Black Sea in 1919 as part of Britain's involvement in the Russian Civil War.

ELCW served for a total of 27 years until final discharge from the RN on 10th October 1945. Along the way he was awarded three GC Badges and the Naval Long Service and Good Conduct Medal in 1935. He also had service in the Second World War on the gunboat HMS Grasshopper on the Yangtse River in China, and was awarded the the 1939-1945 Star, the Defence Medal, and the 1939-1945 War Medal.

His medal entitlement for the First World War was the British War Medal and Victory Medal, as shown in the RN Medal Roll on The roll shows his Rank/Rading as "Ord." for "Ordinary Seaman, which appears to date the compilation of the roll as 4th Debruary 1920 to12th January 1921These are noted as issued to him at HMS Columbine (which I understand to have been a shore base in Scotland); he was at Columbine (Verdun and then Tribune) 4th December 1923 to 31st December 1925. So this seems to date when the medals were actually issued.

I have always assumed that his medals were issued for his service in the Black Sea (South Russia). I can't see that he was otherwise entitled to WW1 medals. I purchased the BWM and LSGC medals some years ago; they were sewn side-by-side onto a "two-medal mounting bar" and by the wear of the ribbons they had been worn on a number of occasions. The Victory Medal was not present - I assume lost. Neither were the medals for the Second World War present.

I recently decided to frame the medals, and duly purchased a good replica VM, and genuine Second World War medals - even if these latter did not belong to ELCW they recognise the service of someone else.

The LSGC medal is impressed as expected. from his service record (HMS Excellent at the time of the award). What puzzles me now that I come to look closely at the BWM is that his rank/rating is shown as "Boy 2". He was never a "Boy 2" on HMS Caradoc, and neither does "Boy 2" match the "Ord." on the medal roll.

Could someone offer an explanation please?

Thank you.

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