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 1 
 on: 05 April 2019 08:51:38 pm 
Started by stuart kilminster - Last Post by chathamrat
Thats absolutely splendid - I'm very grateful.

Boilers seemed to be the family business, as William's son, my Dad, tended them at Chatham Dockyard through WW2, a period which included 3 years on a floating dock in Bermuda. Not me though - I "did' trains!

Very best wishes

Richard B

 2 
 on: 02 April 2019 02:35:03 pm 
Started by stuart kilminster - Last Post by PhiloNauticus
Richard

The TARTAR he served on would have been the torpedo-boat destroyer (TBD) launched in 1907 and handed over to the Navy the following year: quite a full history may be found on Wiki:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Tartar_(1907)

In 1904 the new First Sea Lord, Admiral ‘Jacky’ Fisher, ordered that all future torpedo-boat destroyers should be oil-fired and over the next few years a group of twelve ships were ordered from different shipbuilders, to their own designs using oil-fired steam turbines.

The ships were  given names previously used by small ships of the Royal Navy, and because these included names such as Zulu, Mohawk and Maori, they became known as the Tribal class. 

Although the ships did achieve very high speeds, 34 – 36 knots, compared to 24 – 26 knots of the coal-fired ships, the ships were not deemed a great success: none of them were good ‘sea boats’ (i.e. they rolled too much and shipped too much water) and it was found that fuel consumption was higher than predicted. 

TARTAR when completed was part of the First Destroyer Flotilla attached to the Blenheim, based at Chatham. An outline of her service during the time your relative was serving onboard:   
1908 – 16 April commissioned at Southampton; then to the Medway to join the 1st DF.  Exercises locally and North Sea; port calls: Harwich / Kirkwall / Portsmouth
1909 – exercises locally and port calls: Harwich / South Queensferry / Fortrose / Lowestoft / Portsmouth
1910 – as before: exercises in North Sea and port calls: Harwich / Lowestoft / Portsmouth / Portland
1911 – as before: exercises locally and North Sea: port calls: Harwich / Portsmouth / Kirkwall

Small vessels like these early TBD’s (the term was later abbreviated to Destroyer) were not big enough to carry their own admin staff, so they had what was known as a “parent ship”, that looked after the pay and secretarial work.  This would usually be the vessels that were known as Depot Ships, at this time usually an elderly warship retired from active work.  The Blenheim was converted for this role in 1907. I would imagine he was drafted to Blenheim and then allocated to one of the TBD’s she was “parenting”.   It became the usual practice later to note the name of any destroyer a man was allocated to from the Depot Ship, on the Service Record, usually in brackets after the Depot Ships name, such as Blenheim (Tartar). This clearly did not happen with this record – probably because it was not yet a widespread practice.
TARTAR photo:
https://www.worldnavalships.com/ship_photo.php?ProdID=111502


 3 
 on: 01 April 2019 07:36:47 pm 
Started by stuart kilminster - Last Post by chathamrat
New to this Forum, and the site. I'm Richard Bourne, born and raised Chatham, but lived away since early 1970s. I've no connection with the Navy except through my Grandfather William, who's the subject of this message.

Stuart's been doing some digging for me in pursuit of information to accompany a small display of old Bill's WW1 medals. The reply from PhiloNauticus was certainly impressive, but there's one aspect on which perhaps he could comment further.

There's another ship of interest which doesn’t appear on his record. His Marriage certificate (from 1909) gives his "Rank or Profession" as Stoker on HM Ship Tartar. This is further borne out by an entry in the 1911 census, where the List of Officers, Crew and Royal Marines on board His Majesty's Ship "Tartar" includes SPO William Bourne, born Ashford Kent aged 34. A web search for Tartar came up with one description saying "one of the first ocean-going destroyers to be driven by steam turbines". As an oil burner shovelling was evidently no longer required and its pleasing to see that his conduct must have by then been good enough for him to be let loose on something relatively novel! I'd be interested to know more about that HMS Tartar (I see there were earlier and later ships of that name), and perhaps to understand why he was still recorded as being on the Blenheim.

I'd be grateful for any comments. Thanks in anticipation

Richard B

 4 
 on: 27 March 2019 10:02:11 pm 
Started by Deben - Last Post by Deben
Thank you very much PhiloNauticus for the clear responses.  It helps me with a surprise project for a relative who never knew the details of her father's naval service.  Thank you again for the prompt response.

 5 
 on: 27 March 2019 01:55:07 pm 
Started by Deben - Last Post by PhiloNauticus

Re; 5 - on reflection, probably Chemical, Atomic and Biological Warfare = C, A & B

 6 
 on: 27 March 2019 01:52:39 pm 
Started by Deben - Last Post by PhiloNauticus

1 & 2 = TAS usually stood for Torpedo, Anti-Submarine which indicates the branch specialisation
DTASW = Director, torpedo and anti-submarine warfare division

3. The Survey Training Unit was set up in the RN Barracks, Chatham (i.e. HMS Pembroke) in 1948 until it moved to RN Barracks Devonport in 1959. It was responsible for training ratings as Survey Recorders

4. President – was the name of a ‘parent’ establishment acting as an accounting base. It was based in London, but covered personnel in scattered locations.  I do not know what ‘APL’ stood for.  The Navy List for the relevant year(s) may offer a clearer picture

5. C, A&B warfare – not certain, but perhaps Chemical and Anti-Biological warfare training – see: https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C4841625

6. A.F.O. – Admiralty Fleet Order; these were orders issued to all ships and establishments. They were sequentially numbered in each year, so this refers to Admiralty Fleet Order number 1094 of 1949
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C2707973

 7 
 on: 27 March 2019 01:10:25 pm 
Started by Landlubber - Last Post by PhiloNauticus

You could try contacting an ex-Fleetwood

https://www.forcesreunited.co.uk/units/1611/hms-fleetwood

 8 
 on: 26 March 2019 09:08:38 pm 
Started by Deben - Last Post by Deben
Good Evening Members,

Concerns a Roy Derek Rowe, who joined as an Ordinary Seaman on 24 March 1942, and left 17 March 1954 as a Lt Cdr.  The abbreviations/ terminology I am seeking to understand are in red & a couple of questions:

1:  DTASW (?) is a feint entry whilst at HMS Racer (Larne, NI) serving on RML's (Rescue Motor Launch) in 1943.

2. T.A.S.W.D (?)  course at HMS Pembroke in 1952

3. Was there a Surveying Training unit at HMS Pembroke in 1952. I cant find any reference to this type of course being run there, at Chatham...I assume!

4. HMS President (APL) ??  Any ideas on APL?  It also records for "duty inside Admiralty" - what this actually mean?  As he also has an entry "for duty outside Admty".  What is the difference between two besides the obvious?

5. Whilst at/on HMS Indomitable (1947) he completed C. A&B Warfare Cse. Or could read C A+B Warfare Course?

6. Finally his S.206 file (Officer Confidential Reports) often states "in accordance with A.F.O 1094/49" for example.  A.F.O. stands for?

Would be great if you are able to throw some light on these questions

 9 
 on: 26 March 2019 05:22:54 pm 
Started by Landlubber - Last Post by Landlubber
HI,
I'm wondering if it's possible to find out if someone served on a particular ship (HMS Fleetwood) in a certain decade (late 1950s).
Can anyone help or point me in the right direction ?
I will go into more detail and explain why I'm making this enquiry should I get a helpful response to my query.
Thanks.

 10 
 on: 26 March 2019 05:03:53 pm 
Started by Landlubber - Last Post by Landlubber
HI,
I'm wondering if it's possible to find out if someone served on a particular ship (HMS Fleetwood) in a certain decade (late 1950s).
Can anyone help or point me in the right direction ?
I will go into more detail and explain why if required should I get a helpful response to my query.
Thanks.

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